玩偶姐姐

Gasolina commum in Copacabana is around R$5.50 a litre and in Petropolis it is R$6.50.......changes daily.

Ethanol is the cheapest at around R$1 - 1.50 less.

And your liters per kilometer, or is it kilometers per liter?

I don't track that as I usually walk 10,000 + steps a day. I might buy gas once every 2-3 weeks, if that. We go days, or even a week, without using our car. It's a 12 year old FIAT with a 1.0 litre engine, can't use much gas.

Problem in cities is that parking is insanely expensive. R$6-20 per half hour......for short term. I was just downtown in Rio yesterday @ Detran. R$20 per half hour to park around Ave Presidente Vargas. We take the metro when going DT.....R$15 round trip. And then there are flanelinhas everywhere else you have to pay, so, walking it is. Even shopping malls charge you a lot to park. Uber gets more use than our car does because once parking is calculated, the round trip Uber fare is often the same, or less, than just the parking costs !! I'd rather support a Carioca driver too, than pay taxes via fuel use.

@Alan - here you go... just calculate for a 1km trip:

But if you're looking for real costs, well, the formula gets more complex. Tires, parts, labor, insurance, licensing... makes that Taxi ride (Uber, metro, bike) seem a lot more attractive.

I sure do wish Brazilian cities were more focused on the costs of private car costs, from the perspective of road building and so much more. I watch as cities (SP, Recife, Jo茫o Pessoa) become insufferable places given the demand by so many for their own personal vehicles.

MattB

@mberigan

Does a new Fiat Mobi get 15km/l on gasoline and 10km/l on alcohol? Do these numbers look reasonable?

@kolyaS122HSU

You鈥檙e preaching to the choir. I haven鈥檛 owned a car in ten years.

@mberigan

Brazilians do seem to aspire to be Angelenos. Ilh茅us is paving the beach, just like Southern California did in the 1960s.

@mberigan Does a new Fiat Mobi get 15km/l on gasoline and 10km/l on alcohol? Do these numbers look reasonable? - @alan279

Yes, that is realistic. Thing is, the reason the FIAT Mobi is cheap right now (R$63.000 about $10K USD) is that it has been discontinued as of next year. If anyone is thinking of buying FWIW. There are a couple of UBER drivers here that use them and they seem happy.

@alan279

They look about right. Of course, 鈥測our kilometer-age may vary.鈥� FYI - This particular car is a very, how do I say, BASIC car. Rides like crap, ok for getting around town. I wouldn鈥檛 drive it more than 80km from point A to point B. I rented one for 10 days.

I'm reading that electric cars may cost the same as internal combustion engine cars soon. Would electricity be cheaper per kilometer than gasoline or ethanol in Brazil?

12/18/24聽 I'm reading that electric cars may cost the same as internal combustion engine cars soon. Would electricity be cheaper per kilometer than gasoline or ethanol in Brazil? - @alan279

Here in Manaus they're much cheaper to operate than gasoline cars, per every Uber driver we've talked to who has one.聽 Some cautions:

1. The Chinese are currently giving away a charging station with every car.聽 No telling how long that will last;
2. The cars they're selling here have eight year warranties on the motors and the batteries.聽 聽No telling how long that will last, either;
3. The manufacturers are currently providing very affordable financing;
4. Manaus has no highway connections to the rest of the country, so long distance travel isn't much of an issue, except to Roraima and beyond to Venezuela.

Here in Manaus they're much cheaper to operate than gasoline cars, per every Uber driver we've talked to who has one. Some cautions:

The Chinese are currently giving away a charging station with every car. No telling how long that will last;
The cars they're selling here have eight year warranties on the motors and the batteries. No telling how long that will last, either;
The manufacturers are currently providing very affordable financing;
Manaus has no highway connections to the rest of the country, so long distance travel isn't much of an issue, except to Roraima and beyond to Venezuela.
- @abthree

Very interesting. Thanks.

@mberigan
Does a new Fiat Mobi get 15km/l on gasoline and 10km/l on alcohol? Do these numbers look reasonable? - @alan279

Yeah - the normal accepted balance is around 70% I believe, when the lower cost of ethanol is balanced by the lower distance covered - ie if ethanol is around 70% or so of the gasoline cost, it is a better deal... However, I prefer the power offered by gasoline compared to ethanol in my territory, as, at times, I need to go "off road" and need that power...

12/18/24 Yeah - the normal accepted balance is around 70% I believe, when the lower cost of ethanol is balanced by the lower distance covered - ie if ethanol is around 70% or so of the gasoline cost, it is a better deal... However, I prefer the power offered by gasoline compared to ethanol in my territory, as, at times, I need to go "off road" and need that power...
- @Peter Itamaraca

I notice the same thing here, talking to Uber drivers. Gasoline today is R$6.99 in Manaus and ethanol is R$4.99, but most drivers with flexfuel vehicles that we talk to still prefer gasoline for the additional power and the reduced evaporation loss in our consistently hot climate.

@mberigan
Brazilians do seem to aspire to be Angelenos. Ilh茅us is paving the beach, just like Southern California did in the 1960s. - @alan279

Sorry to hear that Ilh茅us is on that road.

Yeah! Asphalt is [somehow] a measure of "progress" as is concrete. I've watched most of the northeastern "destinations" turn into uninteresting mob-scene places I simply won't return to unless I have to. Everyone wants a piece of聽 "paradise" and in the end turn it into, well, a mess.

But it does make a lot of money for those who only care about money!

mberigan

I believe, when the lower cost of ethanol is balanced by the lower distance covered - ie if ethanol is around 70% or so of the gasoline cost, it is a better deal...

@peter_itamaraca, is the ethanol blend E15 in Brazil or higher ethanol content?聽 I did not check recently but I think that E15 is mandatory in CA. If this is the case, then yes, ethanol is a better deal and it is also better for the environment.聽 Is this lower price because of abundant supply of ethanol or because of a government policy?

However, ethanol does absorb moisture and this (together with its lower energy content) really reduces its effectiveness as a fuel.聽

Yeah! Asphalt is [somehow] a measure of "progress" as is concrete. I've watched most of the northeastern "destinations" turn into uninteresting mob-scene places I simply won't return to unless I have to. Everyone wants a piece of "paradise" and in the end turn it into, well, a mess.

But it does make a lot of money for those who only care about money!

mberigan - @mberigan

@mberigan,

Is this not a good thing for the country?聽 If the goal of the country is to depend less on import / export, this should increase local consumption - which will boost the GDP.

I understand that there is usually a mess created in the process but is the end goal of making everyone "richer" a worthy one?

May be there is another way to keep paradise and get higher GDP - like Costa Rica is doing by offering eco-tourism.聽 Will this model even work in Brazil?

How do people in Brazil measure what constitutes "paradise"?聽 I suspect that they would say "dinheiro"...聽 What do you think?

Isn鈥檛 electric power half the cost of gasoline for cars?

@mberigan Brazilians do seem to aspire to be Angelenos. Ilh茅us is paving the beach, just like Southern California did in the 1960s.聽 - @alan279Sorry to hear that Ilh茅us is on that road.Yeah! Asphalt is [somehow] a measure of "progress" as is concrete. I've watched most of the northeastern "destinations" turn into uninteresting mob-scene places I simply won't return to unless I have to. Everyone wants a piece of "paradise" and in the end turn it into, well, a mess.But it does make a lot of money for those who only care about money!mberigan - @mberigan

You just described Cabo Frio and Buzios. I've been going there 20+ years......it's a different place than it was before.